3:10 - we have created a system outside the system - things that were once good ideas have been corrupted beyond belief, giving power to arrogant, power mad disgusting politicians of the worst kind. She is one. There is not doubt.
Bonnie Neely got her revenge today, using her position as Coastal Commissioner. Pierson got his money's worth, and she got her revenge, and the people of Eureka lost.
That a "hearing" like this can be held, where the people involved do not even get to speak, is something that has to be changed, and it has to be changed legislatively in order to put a stop to people like this.
The same way it came to be - in order to stop something bad, now it has to be amended to stop something equally bad.
And, Dave, the baby boomer are some of the best educated people the planet has ever seen, they have had things easy, with riches given to them beyond compare in history - they were once independent and resourceful.
Why they have allowed charlatans like Al Gore to demand that they don the hair shirts and self-flagellate in order to assuage some phony guilt-trip, I do not understand.
I also do not understand why some of us are immune to the kool-aid, but at this point I am in favor of splitting the nation in two - you liberal "Progressives" can have one half and we will take the other. You can have all your angst, all your guilt, all your regulations, all your hate, all your job-killing mentality - and we'll just see how long you last. No trading back allowed.
Rose, the baby boomers are better educated because they had access to free college in California before Ronald Regan cut that wastefull spending.
As far as one baby per couple? How about those of us that didn't have any kids sell one kid credit to someone that wants two?
Since kids don't get the education they used to without a lot of money, only those that can afford them would have them and then they would all be smart like you Rose.
Rose, the baby boomers are better educated because they had access to free college in California before Ronald Regan cut that wastefull spending.
As far as one baby per couple? How about those of us that didn't have any kids sell one kid credit to someone that wants two?
Since kids don't get the education they used to without a lot of money, only those that can afford them would have them and then they would all be smart like you Rose.
You didn't even attempt to answer my questions Rose.
(1)You'r a baby boomer too right?
(2)What is the answer for the predicted population explosion? Do you have any ideas?
Please set aside all of your partisan rhetoric Rose, and try to focus on answering my questions.
I'd just like to hear an alternative from you for once, and not a liberal/conservative partisan spiel. It would be refreshing, and would give you more credibility.
The Population Bomb has not occurred, Dave. They were predicting the end of days back when we were in high school, remember?
To answer your questions would mean accepting your premise that the end of days are nigh so we have to impose China-like restrictions on ourselves - I don't buy it - and the unspoken premise, that it is US who have to control OUR population, but you would say and do nothing about all other countries and religions.
You've lived long enough to see these Chicken Little predictions come and go - you've even lived long enough to see the Climategate liars exposed.
Why is that a partisan issue?
And are you REALLY accepting without question the idea that we must only have ONE child? It used to be two, self sustaining only.
How can you do that when you have seen the results in China? the butchering of baby girls. And the family traumas and guilts that go with that.
Is that what you want?
My God. I know people here who have adopted baby girls from China, saving their lives.
You'd like to hear an alternative from me - an alternative to killing girl babies? Involuntary sterilization? Mandatory abortions?
My alternative, Dave, would be we stop and recognize that big government, big brother, is a bad thing, and we would be doing everything in our power to stop it. and we most certainly would not be donning hair shirts and passively handing over our rights to make personal decisions to corrupt governmental officials from any country.
But, another alternative would be - all of you who believe population is a problem, take Patty Berg's suicide pill. You go first.
The proven method of birth control for nations has been to bring their overall economic conditions up past basic survival needs for most of the population. A higher standard of living results in fewer births per family, e.g. Japan. As more and more Chinese achieve prosperity, the lower their birthrates will naturally drop as has Europe's birthrate. No real need for draconian steps as China has taken in the past which have resulted in enormous family disruption and psychic pain. This is why we should try our best to upgrade all Third World countries' economies by sharing cooperatively instead of the present capitalist system of rich get richer/poor get poorer. The poor have historically had more children to offset economic disadvantage with family helpers.
I read recently that the Earth's population is expected to level off and/ or decline. I don't recall when this was predicted to happen. I think it was in 10 or 20 years.
What's up with telling me to take a suicide pill first?
Your absolute hatred of those who think different than you seems to be growing. When I first read your blog you seemed reasonable and presented good arguments.
I don't know if you can't get over Obama being president or what.
It's sad to see all your comments so full of malice.
You sure are carrying around a lot of baggage.
What happened to reason? You have become so blind in your ideology that you can no longer see straight.
Sigh. Dave. You - the COLLECTIVE you - the people who think mankind is a scourge and that the population needs to be reduced by any means necessary - THAT is what it means. Maybe that doesn't mean YOU, the person.
Maybe you, like any sane and rational person, can say, "No!" we are not going to be led down the path to the point that we act like China.
Human rights, Dave. China is one of the biggest abusers. A year ago, we all knew that. What happened? Now - YOU - take this notion that a governmental body can impose and one child per family restriction and YOU say, meekly, "OK." out of guilt for "the predicted population explosion."
And, I say to you, YOU - IF you honestly believe that it is necessary to KILL somebody to reduce the population, you first. Leave me out of it. That's all.
I can make up my own mind. I sure don't want a governmental body making up my mind for me. That's NOT what we are about here. Or it wasn't. But if enough people go down that slippery slope with YOU, whether it be the collective you or the individual you, we're in serious trouble.
The question is - how much of your right to self determination are you willing to give up?
And are you really going to take dictation from a hypocrite like Al Gore? I don't care what party you are. And I don't know why PARTY has come to be the overriding defining characteristic. No matter what party you are, YOU have a right to decide for yourself. Big government will end up hurting ALL people, and this move by China is a VERY CLEAR EXAMPLE. Which of your children are you willing to sacrifice?
Mr. Sebourn, the word is “wasteful” and not “wastefull.” I don’t believe that baby boomers are more educated because Reagan made cuts in wasteful spending. I believe that currently they are less educated because they don’t take courses and majors in things that will allow them to be employed and contribute to society. Ever take a look at the curriculums? I can’t believe that we pay for a lot of these bizarre classes. We are teaching things like business, science, etc., to those persons from foreign countries because our youth would rather suck on the government or their parents and take underwater basketweaving. I hold several post secondary degrees, one of which is doctorate and have been gainfully employed because I chose to take classes and a major that I could find good employment in.
Dave: “we” should do nothing about the predicted population explosion except inform people about it. This is a free society. Period. Do you think that putting things to sterilize people in their water is ok? The fact is that population control is with the individual and not the collective or the government. People have laid down their lives to protect that freedom and will continue to do so. Thank goodness the vast majority of us would spit in your face for being so contemptuous about our inalienable rights. Don't get me wrong, you clearly have the right to believe what you want, but I have the right to think you are disgusting and un-American.
Where in my posts did you see that I supported China's actions?
You didn't see anything that suggested that I thought China was doing the right thing. Yet...you assume that I'm for China's children policy.
I'm totally against China's policy and any policy telling people they can or can't have children.
I was seeking a solution from you. I asked you what could be done? And what your thoughts are.
Instead, you go off on a rant based upon you crystal ball thinking that I am for such a horrible policy.
I don't belong to any party, so you can stop trying to throw me in with your hated for those that don't think (or vote) like you.
Your world is black or white. It's them against you. Look back at what I said and your replies...
I'm trying to communicate with you like an adult Rose, so please don't assume things about me.
You said you against China's policy. Good. We know that now. What should be done about it?
As far as the anonymous remarks by some coward whose obviously afraid of me; why don't you crawl back in your hole unless your ready to "man up" and say what your problem is.
I pride myself into looking at all angles of any story. As a journalist most of my life, I've always made sure that there was a balance in my reporting. My Opinions pieces are different, because I take a stand on a subject and give material to support it.
I find that a balanced approach to reading and talking with people to be more productive, and not to get all excited if people don't agree with me.
Dave said: "As far as the anonymous remarks by some coward whose obviously afraid of me; why don't you crawl back in your hole unless your ready to "man up" and say what your problem is."
1) This is a blog Dave. Most people are anonymous.
2) I am not afraid of you. I am disgusted by you.
3)) I am a woman you jerk and I am simply addressing the points you made earlier. The fact is that neither you, your collective circle jerkers or the government has any right whatsoever to tell me or any other woman if I am going to have 1, 10 or no children. If you can't handle that, then quit typing your drivel here or in your senseless op-eds in the TS.
4) The only "hole" around here is your vacuous cranium.
If you'll notice I was against any kind of population control requiring the government limiting children. If you can point out where I supported this concept, please do.
No, it's obvious that you aren't into the issues - you just don't like me. And if I'm right about who you are...that's just too damn bad!
Don't you have anything better to do with your time than just call people names and spew venom?
"The fact is that neither you, your collective circle jerkers or the government has any right whatsoever to tell me or any other woman if I am going to have 1, 10 or no children."
And neither you nor your collective circle of freeloaders has any right to expect one thin dime from the government to support your children. Whether you have 1, 10 or none, you're going to get off your butt and work because the rest of us are sick of supporting you.
1:52, I agree with you that freeloaders have no right to expect one thin dime from the government. For those that sit on their butt instead of working and justify it by having litters, I agree, no support. But you do not impose population control...you just say you ain't gonna fund someone for having more children than they can afford. People can still choose, and then we are not the enablers. To me the issues (choice and freeloading) are like apples and oranges.
Oh, and Dave, you are so full of shit. Is your head about to explode? Who the fuck is Judy? You evidently have issues with her, but I am not suprised that you assume the worst about a person you evidently feel "small" when compared to. Just a female hunch about a small minded arrogant sexist. I am a patient woman, but my tolerance of your kind of arrogance, hypocrisy and sexism is at about zero.
That is funny 4:36. I am in a room full of happy folks laughing about you (got a handheld device) and you are probably all alone in you dark dingy room hating the idea of any woman who won't eat your sexist bull.
Not that far.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteYou're a baby boomer too, aren't you Rose?
ReplyDeleteWhat do you think should be done about the predicted population explosion?
Vasectomy for you, Dave...
ReplyDelete3:10 - we have created a system outside the system - things that were once good ideas have been corrupted beyond belief, giving power to arrogant, power mad disgusting politicians of the worst kind. She is one. There is not doubt.
ReplyDeleteBonnie Neely got her revenge today, using her position as Coastal Commissioner. Pierson got his money's worth, and she got her revenge, and the people of Eureka lost.
That a "hearing" like this can be held, where the people involved do not even get to speak, is something that has to be changed, and it has to be changed legislatively in order to put a stop to people like this.
The same way it came to be - in order to stop something bad, now it has to be amended to stop something equally bad.
And, Dave, the baby boomer are some of the best educated people the planet has ever seen, they have had things easy, with riches given to them beyond compare in history - they were once independent and resourceful.
ReplyDeleteWhy they have allowed charlatans like Al Gore to demand that they don the hair shirts and self-flagellate in order to assuage some phony guilt-trip, I do not understand.
I also do not understand why some of us are immune to the kool-aid, but at this point I am in favor of splitting the nation in two - you liberal "Progressives" can have one half and we will take the other. You can have all your angst, all your guilt, all your regulations, all your hate, all your job-killing mentality - and we'll just see how long you last. No trading back allowed.
Rose,
ReplyDeleteThe South lost the Civil War. Get used to it.
Rose, the baby boomers are better educated because they had access to free college in California before Ronald Regan cut that wastefull spending.
ReplyDeleteAs far as one baby per couple?
How about those of us that didn't have any kids sell one kid credit to someone that wants two?
Since kids don't get the education they used to without a lot of money, only those that can afford them would have them and then they would all be smart like you Rose.
Rose, the baby boomers are better educated because they had access to free college in California before Ronald Regan cut that wastefull spending.
ReplyDeleteAs far as one baby per couple?
How about those of us that didn't have any kids sell one kid credit to someone that wants two?
Since kids don't get the education they used to without a lot of money, only those that can afford them would have them and then they would all be smart like you Rose.
You didn't even attempt to answer my questions Rose.
ReplyDelete(1)You'r a baby boomer too right?
(2)What is the answer for the predicted population explosion? Do you have any ideas?
Please set aside all of your partisan rhetoric Rose, and try to focus on answering my questions.
I'd just like to hear an alternative from you for once, and not a liberal/conservative partisan spiel.
It would be refreshing, and would give you more credibility.
The Population Bomb has not occurred, Dave. They were predicting the end of days back when we were in high school, remember?
ReplyDeleteTo answer your questions would mean accepting your premise that the end of days are nigh so we have to impose China-like restrictions on ourselves - I don't buy it - and the unspoken premise, that it is US who have to control OUR population, but you would say and do nothing about all other countries and religions.
You've lived long enough to see these Chicken Little predictions come and go - you've even lived long enough to see the Climategate liars exposed.
Why is that a partisan issue?
And are you REALLY accepting without question the idea that we must only have ONE child? It used to be two, self sustaining only.
How can you do that when you have seen the results in China? the butchering of baby girls. And the family traumas and guilts that go with that.
Is that what you want?
My God. I know people here who have adopted baby girls from China, saving their lives.
I am stunned.
You'd like to hear an alternative from me - an alternative to killing girl babies? Involuntary sterilization? Mandatory abortions?
ReplyDeleteMy alternative, Dave, would be we stop and recognize that big government, big brother, is a bad thing, and we would be doing everything in our power to stop it. and we most certainly would not be donning hair shirts and passively handing over our rights to make personal decisions to corrupt governmental officials from any country.
But, another alternative would be - all of you who believe population is a problem, take Patty Berg's suicide pill. You go first.
The proven method of birth control for nations has been to bring their overall economic conditions up past basic survival needs for most of the population. A higher standard of living results in fewer births per family, e.g. Japan. As more and more Chinese achieve prosperity, the lower their birthrates will naturally drop as has Europe's birthrate. No real need for draconian steps as China has taken in the past which have resulted in enormous family disruption and psychic pain. This is why we should try our best to upgrade all Third World countries' economies by sharing cooperatively instead of the present capitalist system of rich get richer/poor get poorer. The poor have historically had more children to offset economic disadvantage with family helpers.
ReplyDeleteI read recently that the Earth's population is expected to level off and/ or decline. I don't recall when this was predicted to happen. I think it was in 10 or 20 years.
ReplyDeleteIn other words, NO, Dave. It's more "partisan speil" and even more hysteria than usual.
ReplyDeleteWhat's up with telling me to take a suicide pill first?
ReplyDeleteYour absolute hatred of those who think different than you seems to be growing.
When I first read your blog you seemed reasonable and presented good arguments.
I don't know if you can't get over Obama being president or what.
It's sad to see all your comments so full of malice.
You sure are carrying around a lot of baggage.
What happened to reason? You have become so blind in your ideology that you can no longer see straight.
AGAIN DAVE A VASECTOMY WOULD BE OUR FIRST HOPE FOR YOU AND OTHERS LIKE YOU.
ReplyDeleteSigh. Dave. You - the COLLECTIVE you - the people who think mankind is a scourge and that the population needs to be reduced by any means necessary - THAT is what it means. Maybe that doesn't mean YOU, the person.
ReplyDeleteMaybe you, like any sane and rational person, can say, "No!" we are not going to be led down the path to the point that we act like China.
Human rights, Dave. China is one of the biggest abusers. A year ago, we all knew that. What happened? Now - YOU - take this notion that a governmental body can impose and one child per family restriction and YOU say, meekly, "OK." out of guilt for "the predicted population explosion."
And, I say to you, YOU - IF you honestly believe that it is necessary to KILL somebody to reduce the population, you first. Leave me out of it. That's all.
I can make up my own mind. I sure don't want a governmental body making up my mind for me. That's NOT what we are about here. Or it wasn't. But if enough people go down that slippery slope with YOU, whether it be the collective you or the individual you, we're in serious trouble.
The question is - how much of your right to self determination are you willing to give up?
And are you really going to take dictation from a hypocrite like Al Gore? I don't care what party you are. And I don't know why PARTY has come to be the overriding defining characteristic. No matter what party you are, YOU have a right to decide for yourself. Big government will end up hurting ALL people, and this move by China is a VERY CLEAR EXAMPLE. Which of your children are you willing to sacrifice?
Mr. Sebourn, the word is “wasteful” and not “wastefull.” I don’t believe that baby boomers are more educated because Reagan made cuts in wasteful spending. I believe that currently they are less educated because they don’t take courses and majors in things that will allow them to be employed and contribute to society. Ever take a look at the curriculums? I can’t believe that we pay for a lot of these bizarre classes. We are teaching things like business, science, etc., to those persons from foreign countries because our youth would rather suck on the government or their parents and take underwater basketweaving. I hold several post secondary degrees, one of which is doctorate and have been gainfully employed because I chose to take classes and a major that I could find good employment in.
ReplyDeleteDave: “we” should do nothing about the predicted population explosion except inform people about it. This is a free society. Period. Do you think that putting things to sterilize people in their water is ok? The fact is that population control is with the individual and not the collective or the government. People have laid down their lives to protect that freedom and will continue to do so. Thank goodness the vast majority of us would spit in your face for being so contemptuous about our inalienable rights. Don't get me wrong, you clearly have the right to believe what you want, but I have the right to think you are disgusting and un-American.
"... you are disgusting and un-American."
ReplyDeleteThe most "Un-American" stance of all is intolerance.
Where in my posts did you see that I supported China's actions?
ReplyDeleteYou didn't see anything that suggested that I thought China was doing the right thing.
Yet...you assume that I'm for China's children policy.
I'm totally against China's policy and any policy telling people they can or can't have children.
I was seeking a solution from you. I asked you what could be done? And what your thoughts are.
Instead, you go off on a rant based upon you crystal ball thinking that I am for such a horrible policy.
I don't belong to any party, so you can stop trying to throw me in with your hated for those that don't think (or vote) like you.
Your world is black or white. It's them against you.
Look back at what I said and your replies...
I'm trying to communicate with you like an adult Rose, so please don't assume things about me.
You said you against China's policy. Good. We know that now.
What should be done about it?
As far as the anonymous remarks by some coward whose obviously afraid of me; why don't you crawl back in your hole unless your ready to "man up" and say what your problem is.
Dave - it is very simple. We should get off the hysteria train.
ReplyDeleteRose it's very simple.
ReplyDeleteI never was on the "hysteria train."
I pride myself into looking at all angles of any story. As a journalist most of my life, I've always made sure that there was a balance in my reporting.
My Opinions pieces are different, because I take a stand on a subject and give material to support it.
I find that a balanced approach to reading and talking with people to be more productive, and not to get all excited if people don't agree with me.
Dave said: "As far as the anonymous remarks by some coward whose obviously afraid of me; why don't you crawl back in your hole unless your ready to "man up" and say what your problem is."
ReplyDelete1) This is a blog Dave. Most people are anonymous.
2) I am not afraid of you. I am disgusted by you.
3)) I am a woman you jerk and I am simply addressing the points you made earlier. The fact is that neither you, your collective circle jerkers or the government has any right whatsoever to tell me or any other woman if I am going to have 1, 10 or no children. If you can't handle that, then quit typing your drivel here or in your senseless op-eds in the TS.
4) The only "hole" around here is your vacuous cranium.
Oh I see Anonymous (or should I say Judy!)...
ReplyDeleteThis isn't about right or wrong.
If you'll notice I was against any kind of population control requiring the government limiting children.
If you can point out where I supported this concept, please do.
No, it's obvious that you aren't into the issues - you just don't like me. And if I'm right about who you are...that's just too damn bad!
Don't you have anything better to do with your time than just call people names and spew venom?
Deadlines to keep or something?
"The fact is that neither you, your collective circle jerkers or the government has any right whatsoever to tell me or any other woman if I am going to have 1, 10 or no children."
ReplyDeleteAnd neither you nor your collective circle of freeloaders has any right to expect one thin dime from the government to support your children. Whether you have 1, 10 or none, you're going to get off your butt and work because the rest of us are sick of supporting you.
1:52, I agree with you that freeloaders have no right to expect one thin dime from the government. For those that sit on their butt instead of working and justify it by having litters, I agree, no support. But you do not impose population control...you just say you ain't gonna fund someone for having more children than they can afford. People can still choose, and then we are not the enablers. To me the issues (choice and freeloading) are like apples and oranges.
ReplyDeleteOh, and Dave, you are so full of shit. Is your head about to explode? Who the fuck is Judy? You evidently have issues with her, but I am not suprised that you assume the worst about a person you evidently feel "small" when compared to. Just a female hunch about a small minded arrogant sexist. I am a patient woman, but my tolerance of your kind of arrogance, hypocrisy and sexism is at about zero.
And my patience with your shrill "femminazism" is about out.
ReplyDeleteBTW Have you wondered why people ignore and avoid you?
That is funny 4:36. I am in a room full of happy folks laughing about you (got a handheld device) and you are probably all alone in you dark dingy room hating the idea of any woman who won't eat your sexist bull.
ReplyDeleteH + k's
Whoa. Stop. Guys! Honestly.
ReplyDeleteI know this is an online format - and arguments are ok, but does every discussion have to be an attack?
Holy shit!!! Rose, you do nothing but attack, attack, attack, and now you're calling for civil discourse!
ReplyDeleteHallelujah!
"I am in a room full of happy folks laughing about you (got a handheld device)"
ReplyDeletewhich doesn't have a name?
Thought so. Your "handheld device" doesn't have a name!
ReplyDeleteYou know just as much about politics.
10:36 - good morning. Yes, my handheld device has a name, I call it a hand held device.
ReplyDeleteI am impatiently awaiting your next response.
Response? You're a liar. That's your response.
ReplyDeletePerhaps I should add the word "stupid" as your pathetic attempt to deceive seems to be obvious to everyone but you.
2:37, are you ok? You seem to be in a total meltdown. Now back to Heraldo where you can be nasty with the other goons.
ReplyDelete