◼ Report says regulations hurt state's economy
(09-25) 04:00 PDT Sacramento - -- Regulations on small businesses in California have cost the state's economy $492 billion and 3.8 million jobs, according to a report quietly released by Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger's office this week. Republicans in the Legislature have pounced on the findings and on Thursday called the report the "smoking gun" that proves lawmakers are killing the state's economy through burdensome government mandates. But Democrats and at least one capital think tank are highly skeptical of the accuracy of the findings.
The 84-page report does not specify which regulations were studied and relies on data collected largely by Forbes.
Citing the report, Republicans said the state should suspend implementation of Assembly Bill 32, California's greenhouse gas reduction plan championed by the governor, along with all other new regulations.
"We are protecting ourselves literally to death," said Assemblyman Roger Niello, R-Fair Oaks (Sacramento County), at a Capitol news conference held by Republicans to call for action, including legislative hearings and further study to determine costs, or benefits of specific regulations
Wow! Talk about cooked statistics! The republicans are upset that they can't poison the rest of us to make a buck.
ReplyDeleteYep. The stats are always "cooked" when they reveal the stupidity of the progs. Even when no evidence for the "cooking" is presented. Meanwhile, Kalifornia comes in 3rd behind New York and New Joisey as the worst "tax oppressive" state for businesses.
ReplyDeletequote - "The 84-page report does not specify which regulations were studied and relies on data collected largely by Forbes."
ReplyDeleteData gathered by Forbes used as "proof?" I'm sure they had no agenda.
Not!
And a study that doesn't specify what regulations were studied! Now, does that make sense to you?
Using incomplete, and unknown sources(!) doesn't give the Republicans very much credibility does it?
You don't have to dig too deep to know that wealthy special interests are at work here.
Dave, please stop with the party line. Everyone in this state and in the country knows California is totally screwed right now. Our economy is in the toilet. We have unemployement at about 20% if you count the underemployed and those that simply won't or can't work. We have lost businesses galore, our state income is dependent upon the swings of business and we are totatlly broke, but refuse to stop spending. Something must be done and until we all come to grips with that fact we will continue down the path to oblivion and bankruptcy.
ReplyDeleteI have a small business with about 10 employees and I know what this f'd up state of affairs is doing.
Now, please stop being a broken record and get real. Please.
Funny, Dave. Could the agenda be successful businesses? Jobs for people? Prosperity for all?
ReplyDeleteSee, THEN you could AFFORD your own health insurance. mortgage, car loans, college tuition... you could afford to support not only yourself, but your family, and even help others as you choose.
What a sorry state of affairs when our MEN are so dedicated to the destruction and abdication of our country, our individual rights and our ability to create and construct businesses and improved infrastructure.
It's quite a departure from where we have come. With our current crop of men, we might as well have stayed in the primordial ooze.
"With our current crop of men, we might as well have stayed in the primordial ooze."
ReplyDeleteEr......
Nope, not me.
Let me see if I have this right Anonymous - by stopping the implementation of Assembly Bill 32 all those problems, (20 percent unemployment, and businesses leaving the state) will be solved?
ReplyDeleteI don't think so. Do you really think so?
Businesses are leaving the state for numerous reasons. Taxes would be one of the big ones. Yes, the environmental regulations do play a part, but are hardly responsible for all the states ills.
Our elected state clowns - Republican and Democrat - are not working for the people. They're too busy being courted by special interests like the enviro's and others, to really represent you and I.
By the way, could you skip the scolding next time you don't agree with me?
It's hard enough talking with someone I don't know, but when you treat me like a naive Party Hack that's not being civil.
"What a sorry state of affairs when our MEN are so dedicated to the destruction and abdication of our country, our individual rights and our ability to create and construct businesses and improved infrastructure."
ReplyDeleteWhat a sweeping statement.
By our "MEN" do you mean me, or any man that don't agree with your political beliefs - and how this country should be run?
You're bigger than that Rose.
I am scolding you because you deserve it Dave. And have done so politely I think. Unless and until we get a grip on our bizarre and extremely fluctuating taxes, until we get a grip on how we deal with creating and keeping jobs, until we get control of totally out of control law suits involving every nutty thing imaginable, until we get a grip on how the public gets manipulated by the initiative process, until we control way out of control spending, WE ARE TOTALLY SCREWED AND WE WILL NOT BE ABLE TO PULL CA OUT OF THE TOILET.
ReplyDeleteJust one person's opinion. Dave, how many businesses have you owned and run over the last 15 years or so? Or ever? How many times have you had to deal with lawsuits? How about bizarre government agencies over a proposed project? Or faced baseless lawsuits?
I have found that it has been rather commonplace for those who really have no idea of the problem other than what they READ about it. There are a great many of us who have to live it and can tell you from actual experience.
Dave: "Businesses are leaving the state for numerous reasons."
ReplyDeleteTell us what some of those "reasons" are.
Leonidas......Now that is not fair. It requires Fact. I thought you understood...... Sheesh
ReplyDeleteAnonymous:
ReplyDeleteYou state that we have to get a grip on our taxes.
Isn't that what I said was the big problem?
Of course you're entitled to your opinion. I give that respect to everyone.
Because I never owned a business I don't know what's going on? People who just READ stuff?
How about that I ran a business with 64 employees as the Publisher of The Arcata Union, The Triplicate, and the Redwood Record?
You want to talk about taxes? How about health care for employees?
Maybe baseless court cases? Listen, I dealt with them all, under conditions you wouldn't believe.
So come down from your high horse, and give me some credit rather than saying "You needed scolding."
You owe me an apology for assuming things about me and trying to write me off as being naive, not understanding, etc.
How about that?
Leonidas:
I gave what I believe is the biggest reason, don't you think?
(Quote)Taxes would be one of the big ones. Yes, the environmental regulations do play a part, but are hardly responsible for all the states ills.
Howlsatmoon:
Can you please explain your comment?
I'm not sure how to take it unless you're saying that I don't use facts to make a point.
Example?
Dave,
ReplyDeleteHumboldt Heretic linked to the tax argument piece authored by the Tax Foundation and the original posting quoted the regulatory burden. You discounted the impact of regulations as the data was published in Forbes (slaying the messenger). It is obvious to most sentient observers that the combination of those two factors contribute hugely to businesses fleeing the state but most of the reasons for the flight are anecdotal.
An example is a friend of ours relocating his Porsche replicating business from Ontario in San Bernardino county to Atlanta due to the continual harassment by local bureaucrats who had no clue as to how polyester resin must be handled. California/San Bernardino county lost all of the jobs and taxes paid by that business. Couple this with the Gestapo like tactics of the CHP in revenue enforcement of commercial carriers (many now refuse to haul freight through or into the state). Also check out the catalogue merchants such as Cabelas and Northern Equipment as well as Grainger and see how many products routinely shipped to 49 states cannot be shipped to California. Keep your head in the sand. It is good for the rest of the country's businesses
Leonida's
ReplyDeleteI don't know what the disagreement is here? We both agree (and that goes for Humboldt heretic)that taxes are a MAJOR PROBLEM right?
I didn't discount Forbes (but let's face it) the magazine is pro business (which is fine). It also is slanted to the right. Which is fine. I'm just saying, I don't take the publication as the one and only source to make a case.
We both know that there are other publications that disagree with Forbes on many fundamental issues.
Finally, can you make a civil post, or is it more fun to bait me and say my head is in the sand?
Just wondering...you had my attention and sounded reasonable until you said that.
.
Why is it considered such a self-satisfying smear to call something PRO BUSINESS?
ReplyDeleteDo you ever stop and think about what that really means?
It means successful businesses, jobs for people, health benefits for people, the ability for people to be self sufficient, afford houses, cars, food, college tuition...
What's the alternative? ANTI BUSINESS - and what does that mean for your community? Your state? Your country?
Well, sadly, I guess you are finding out. And the worst has not yet hit.
I don't mean anything negative by saying "pro business."
ReplyDeleteIt's a label however,and I shouldn't be using labels. I'm really trying hard not too.
It's a challenge to avoid all the negative labels out there that people are quick too assign(I have to count myself in that evaluation at times).
I was using the term "pro business" as an explanation of what the publication's mission was. Nothing more, or less.
We all know that the world is going to hell "in a hand basket" but what can we do? What is the answer?
AEO
ReplyDeleteCan you manage to say ANYTHING without a sneer? It marks you as a frightened little man.
I don't know, dave. I just know I am tired of seeing and hearing those who work, and produce the goods and services - and yes wealth - that makes the good quality of life that we all enjoy possible denigrated by people who've been brainwashed into using the rheotirc and adopting the hate without thinking about what the f-ck they are really saying.
ReplyDeleteEven as a low-income person, if you live in a house with lights and hot and cold running water you live better than alot of the world. And you definitely live better than even the wealthiest kings of old.
So one of the answers is to quit with the class warfare mentality.
No we don't all have yachts. No, we don't all live in mansions. No we don't all drive Rolls Royces. No, we don't all live the lovely life TV and movies portray.
But if you can't look at what you do have in comparison to what life could be like, and if you feel a need - and Dave, I mean the generic you, not you personally, though you always take it that way - if you can't appreciate what you have and celebrate it, then some reflection is needed.
Right now everyone is being all riled up about their miserable health care situation. Oh the horror, oh the injustice, we must act NOW without even reading the bill - and no perspective on just how great we do have it. It wasn't that long ago that when a man, even an important man, like the President, had heart trouble, the best they could do for him was put him in an oxygenated tent and hope for the best. Today, even the common man can have life saving surgery. It wasn't that long ago that a family could lose 3 or 4 children to pneumonia, now we have antibiotics.
I just wish that people would stop and think - and stop buying into the polarizing destructive rhetoric of the "Progressive" con men. They'll tell you that businesses are bad, corporations are bad, people with nice cars are bad, it's mindless drivel.
And you're smarter than that.
Of course Forbes would be interested in a study like that - that is where you are likely to find people who are A. interested, and b. intelligent and educated in that field. You're not going to find it at the local soup kitchen.
Dave,
ReplyDeleteFrom the drift of your postings in this thread it appears you are discounting the fact that the "progressive" climate in California could be the cause of the flight of capital. You even give first billing to the Republicans for being the cause of the problem. Earth to Dave: it's been a while since the Repugs have controlled the legislature. Your aversion to "business" is however shared by a sizable portion of the state's population. If your class warfare philosophy conflicts with data contained in Forbes you can get an alternative slant here or at the Tides Foundation (a "wealthy special interest").
As for your being offended by the metaphor "head in the sand"; I am at a loss that anyone commenting here on Rose's blog could be so thin skinned.
3:59 PM, Sneer??? 1. A scornful facial expression characterized by a slight raising of one corner of the upper lip.
2. A contemptuous facial expression, sound, or statement.
One of the very few things I happen to be "contemptuous" of is willful ignorance, not those with the ability see facial expressions in comments here :o)
Leonidas
ReplyDeleteAppearances are deceptive.
So are assumptions based on "appearances."
All you are doing is spoiling for a fight. I never said I have an aversion to business so you can knock off the class warfare crap. (see my above post on the use of "pro business.")
It's not a matter of being thin-skinned. It's a matter of civil discourse which you seem unable to do.
Your reply about sneering is just another example of the superior attitude you try to project when your called on for being rude.
I don't know what motivates a person like you to go this route. Is there a lot of anger in your life? If so, are making these snide comments making things better for you?
Well Dave/3:59 PM, What will it be, frightened little man or spoiling for a fight?
ReplyDeleteHow about "geezer with several hundred thousand miles where the rubber meets the road" who doesn't revert to "anonymous" when comments might "offend" the sensibilities of a PC progressive?
To resort to "spoiling for a fight" comments when one challenges your leftist assumptions is pathetic. Let's confine our comments to the facts rather than whining about our wounded tender sensibilities. I have pointed out the likely reasons for the capital flight California while you whine about a phony lack of "civility".
Please get a life.
Leonidas,
ReplyDeleteI guess if I had to pick it would be - a frightened old "geezer" spoiling for a fight.
Facts? What a laugh. You have been trying to stereotype me as a "progressive" (shudder) because I wondered why there were no sources given for stats sited in the report in question. It does not specify which regulations were studied. Therefore, how can you say "facts?"
Instead, you took the tired conservative party hack line (you really don't have to think - all you have to do is remember the party line)and went after Forbes as a way to get away from the fact that the 84-page report was crap and you are rolling in it.
Don't give me that "tender feelings" bit either. I try to have civil discourse and you come across like one of the McCoy clan that "don't have no manners - we just shoot our mouths off!"
Talk about getting a life. Better hold the mirror up...yours is passing you by as you attack people anonymously.
Let me make one thing clear to you about that...I think mostly cowards post anonymously.
I'm not afraid to speak out and let people know who I am. I was the same way when I worked. I was ready to talk with anyone - face to face.
If they were polite, so was I. If they weren't, I ran them out of my office!
You run around with your silly little nickname acting like you have all the answers and expect people to take you seriously. You wouldn't know a fact if it bit you in the ass.
Don't worry about talking tough anymore...your wasting your breath coward.
Dave....it's called a nom de plume. Leonidas is no coward by any Warrior's creed. You may disagree with him, but stop. His responses to you are reasonable, and measured.
ReplyDeleteI have a nom de plume also....am I a coward? Want to find out?
Be civil....it's entirely possible on the web to piss off the really wrong People.
Dave....it's called a nom de plume. Leonidas is no coward by any Warrior's creed. You may disagree with him, but stop. His responses to you are reasonable, and measured.
ReplyDeleteI have a nom de plume also....am I a coward? Want to find out?
Be civil....it's entirely possible on the web to piss off the really wrong People.
Wollf
Your right. I shouldn't have said being anonymous makes a person a coward. That was anger.
ReplyDeleteMr Big shot wore out his welcome with me.I don't give a damn who he thinks he is... I'm the WRONG PERSON to piss off!
This has happened before where someone on this site (Rose?) has warned me not to dare piss of this Leonidas jerk.
What are we talking here? The Godfather?
I don't take to threats very well for everyone's information.
Never have, and never will.
If you followed our thread I was the one trying to be civil. He has a problem with me and has been the uncivil one. Go ahead, re-read what we both said.
Can you still claim that his responses have been are REASONABLE AND MEASURED?
I've had about enough of this nonsense. Talk about petty power trips.
Well said, Dave!
ReplyDeleteCVJ
Make that: "lamely spun Dave".
ReplyDeleteDave, you nailed that A..hole perfectly! He doesn't even have the courage to stand up to you here!
ReplyDeleteDon't piss me off. I'm liable to lose it and chop another comment in that ass. Next thing you know you'll be sitting at home,minding your own business... and BANG popping off comments like madness.
ReplyDeleteMake you scared to check your email.